Connection Drives Results with Dr. Michelle Johnston

Judd Shaw: Join me as we explore the complexities of human connection, featuring theorists, scientists, and speakers. Our mission is simple to inspire you to reclaim your true self and create genuine connections with others. Join me as we laid out our armor and live authentically. Hello, you beautiful people. And thanks for tuning in today.

Judd Shaw: We’re speaking with Dr. Michelle Johnston. Dr. Michelle transforms leaders into influential forces. Utilizing her expertise as a distinguished professor in the College of Business at Loyola [00:01:00] University, New Orleans, Michelle inspires audiences as a keynote speaker and shares practical wisdom in her bestselling book, The Seismic Shift in Leadership.

Judd Shaw: Advocating a departure from conventional command and control methods, Dr. Michelle promotes a connection based approach to achieve long lasting results. Let’s find out what’s behind the armor with Dr. Michelle. Dr. Michelle Johnston. I cannot tell you how long I have been eagerly waiting to have this conversation with you.

Michelle Johnson: I feel the same way, Judd, ever since we met in Detroit. And it was just this immediate. Connection and alignment with what we’re both trying to do and the difference we’re trying to make and I can’t wait. Let’s go

Judd Shaw: You know, it’s no coincidence that we had such a strong connection that for the audience We did not coordinate this, [00:02:00] but you and I are both wearing our spring pink.

Judd Shaw: And

Michelle Johnson: you grew up in New Orleans, and that’s where I’m based. How about that? So we have that connection, and then all of our work is centered around connection. And we both have podcasts. I mean, this is super cool. Thank you for having me.

Judd Shaw: That’s my pleasure. And we’re going to dive into how you are such a beautiful catalyst for change, uh, forging authentic connections that are really empowering leaders, um, to their full potential, to rising organizations and teams using authentic human connection.

Judd Shaw: And I wanted, you know, you mentioned that it started When we had that first and very brief meeting at a joint event that we were at, but there was something about that and, and being you’re all [00:03:00] about authentic human connection and that’s my space too. And we’re going to really do such a deep dive on that today.

Judd Shaw: What was it, at least from your perspective, that gave us that immediate,

Michelle Johnson: Yeah, and so that’s what I’m trying to do is figure out. It’s one thing like you got to figure out what in the world is connection. What does it look like? What does it sound like? What does it feel like? What can you do to get more of it since we are in an epidemic of loneliness, disconnection and isolation.

Michelle Johnson: And so you and I are trying to give people tips and strategies. And, and so one of the things I tell people to do, particularly for leaders, cause that’s my primary focus is working with organizations and with leaders is you have to embed. Time to really ask deeper questions so that you can find commonality.

Michelle Johnson: And I literally, I was walking out the door. I’m pretty sure leaving this meeting in Detroit to fly to New York, um, for a work trip trip and, and in our brief conversation. We [00:04:00] immediately realized that you grew up right down the street from where I live, so we have the New Orleans connection. And then everything that you’re doing with your story that you shared with me, that’s what you shared.

Michelle Johnson: You shared your story. It was so powerful, Judd, and, and that you realized that, that you were missing connection, authentic connection. You had to find that in yourself. And then once you did, everything changed for the better, and now you want to help others. And once you shared your story with me, and, and that’s why.

Michelle Johnson: Whenever I work with teams and, and groups of executives, and tomorrow I’m running up to Baton Rouge and working with hundreds of, of leaders, I make sure that the first thing we do is share our stories because once you know someone’s story, it’s very hard to judge. So I think those are the two elements.

Michelle Johnson: We found that we had a lot in common and then I knew your story. And so then I could trust you. I saw you. I felt safe with you. We were aligned. And so that’s what, when, when I’d started [00:05:00] researching and wrote my book, The Seismic Shift in Leadership, I interviewed 18 leaders from around the world, trying to figure this connection thing out, because I realized that the leaders who truly were good in connection were succeeding and the leaders who were totally disconnected from their teams and led with power and control and ego, We’re not succeeding.

Michelle Johnson: And one of the things I found out that what drives connection with self is being able, being in a place and knowing yourself enough where you can show up authentically. And, and I think that’s the essence of what you do and how you lead your life.

Judd Shaw: Thank you. And I really felt that, and I felt our connection.

Judd Shaw: Uh, you remind me that we all have a story, and you know, you are a distinguished professor at Loyal University in New Orleans. Uh, as you noted, you wrote the incredible book, uh, The Seismic Shift in Leadership. You are a renowned keynote speaker, [00:06:00] and you also are an executive coach and have a podcast yourself.

Judd Shaw: And with that, all of that sort of thought leadership that you approach your work with organizations and executives started somewhere. And as I realized that I had a story, there was a behind the armor. With Michelle Johnston, there was this 1. 0 version of her life that existed before catapulting into becoming this change catalyst.

Judd Shaw: Yes.

Michelle Johnson: Oh, absolutely. So you and I are both fans of Brene Brown’s research and I’ll never forget. Um, I don’t know what birthday it was, but one of my good girlfriends gave me Brene’s book, the gifts of imperfection. [00:07:00] And I grew up a corporate brat. And so I was born in Alexandria, Virginia, ended up living in Baltimore, Maryland, East Brunswick, New Jersey, Rochester Hills, Michigan, Hendersonville, Tennessee, Tampa, Florida, Memphis, Tennessee, Birmingham, Alabama.

Michelle Johnson: I mean, we moved and, and it was exciting growing up. I wasn’t miserable at all. It was and just learning about different cultures and different people and just all over the country. And, and I loved making new friends. And yet once I got into my real job at Loyola, I was struggling in the classroom connecting because I just was.

Michelle Johnson: Fitting in. Adapting. I looked around at, okay, what do other professors do? Well, I need to emulate them. And I remember reading Rene Brown’s book, The Gifts of Imperfection, and the first time in my life, and I mean, Judd, I think I was, I was 30 something at least, 35, probably, maybe even older. And I realized that my [00:08:00] entire life I’d been trying to fit in because that’s all I knew since I had to move around so much was just fit in, fit in, fit in, fit in to be accepted.

Michelle Johnson: And her research shows that fitting in is the opposite of belonging. Right. And that in order to truly belong, you have to belong to yourself. And in order to, to do that, you had to connect with yourself. And that was the first time I realized I so wasn’t connected with myself. That’s why I wasn’t doing a good job connecting with others, particularly with students, because I would just march in and lecture and march out and, and make no effort whatsoever on building a culture of connection.

Michelle Johnson: It’s funny because I still, I’ve got to teach my MBA class. Tonight in a couple of hours and last Monday night, I was evaluated by my colleagues. Once a year, they come in and they evaluate just to make sure you know that you’re holding the standards high. And, and I began, I began every single one of my classes with some sort of connection question.

Michelle Johnson: And so [00:09:00] last with my colleagues sitting there, I said, I just want to let y’all know how I’ve evolved as a professor all these years. I never ever would have taken 20 minutes out of art. evening together to ask you about what, since we’ve seen you last, are you most excited about? And I had the two professors who were evaluating me a part of the circle and they got to share what was exciting to them, what has happened that they’re proud of since we last have seen each other.

Michelle Johnson: And it was so powerful Judd because that’s what I learned. I was not trying. to connect at all. I was just one way imparting information, thinking that’s what a professor was supposed to do. And the good news is I know better now. But that was the reason why I just started this huge journey, realizing that I had been disconnected from myself because all I did was try to fit in.

Michelle Johnson: Fitting in, it doesn’t work. And then I wanted to help leaders, the leaders that I was seeing, fail. And a bunch of them were failing. There was [00:10:00] a seismic shift going on in the workplace. The reason they were failing is because they were disconnected and they weren’t taking the time to build connections.

Michelle Johnson: So that’s how it all began for me.

Judd Shaw: I also understand that the fitting in, the cry for belonging, That was also part of your personal life as well. Um, you know, what you were doing, whether it be Loyola classmates, students, et cetera, was sort of mirroring in your personal life, which it seemed to me really was the catapult to finding yourself and your own superpower.

Judd Shaw: Can you tell us about that?

Michelle Johnson: Yeah, I usually don’t talk about my personal life, but I will for you because I know you want to go deep. Um, yeah, I was married and just tried to be. An amazing wife and again, all I knew at the time was just fitting in, fitting in, fitting in. And so I just made the whole world [00:11:00] revolve, um, around my husband at the time and really lost myself.

Michelle Johnson: And that was no fault of his. He, you know, he had a pretty good, um, but it was, it came at a great cost for me because I ended up with no voice. You know, and so I finally had to say I have got to connect with myself. I have to find my voice again. I have to figure out who in the heck I am. What who am I?

Michelle Johnson: What is my story? And I realized that moving around so much, I just, if somebody said, like, if I moved to Birmingham, Alabama, which I did right when I started Auburn University, and he would say, Oh, where are you from? I’d say, Oh, where are you from? And they’d say, Birmingham. I’m from Birmingham. Oh, where, you know, I just was this chameleon and it didn’t work and it’s so surface and you can only go so far with relationships when you don’t even know who you are.

Michelle Johnson: It would have been so much better for me if I would have just been able to say, Hey, I’ve moved around all [00:12:00] over the place. I’m really not from anywhere, um, but I’m so happy to meet you and I’m happy to be at Auburn, but instead I kind of hid pieces and parts of myself like, Oh gosh, I didn’t tell anybody that I really was a Yankee.

Michelle Johnson: I was in the middle of the state of Alabama. I kind of hid that I was really, really, you know, lived in Detroit and East Brunswick cause I was just trying to be, you know, to get accepted and to fit in. And I think that’s what I did in my marriage too, is I just was trying to be accepted and to fit in and to make the world revolve around everybody but me.

Michelle Johnson: And again, it came at a great cost. And I finally had the courage to say, this is not working for me. So my whole career, Truly catapulted and took off after my divorce when I was able to say, I’ve got to figure me out and be really comfortable and strong and who I am. And then everything else can, and then I can help others.

Michelle Johnson: I couldn’t help others without first helping myself.

Judd Shaw: So resonates with me. And I really appreciate you being [00:13:00] vulnerable and sharing that because they’re in lies. The real, to all of us, which is what happens is we begin to drive away from who we really are. Even sometimes these micro actions, they add up to a point where we’re wearing masks.

Judd Shaw: And for me, I wore it so long. I didn’t even know who was behind it anymore. I was someone for this group, someone for this place, someone for work, someone for live, someone for play, someone, but it was all again, fitting in or trying to manipulate a situation or a feeling of unsafetiness and navigating with a hyper vigilant.

Judd Shaw: You know, fight or flight state, who to trust, who not to. It was exhausting and what is exhausting. You’re right, right. And [00:14:00] what I had realized is that whole time in the end, when I was crawled up in a ball in a fetal position, crying on my garage floor, it was because I literally No longer knew who I was as a human.

Judd Shaw: I felt like a, a shell of a human, like who am I? That I think is the most disconnected. The loneliness, the loneliest a human can be.

Michelle Johnson: Oh, absolutely. When you just lose yourself and you, and you just don’t know who you are. Yeah, you’re absolutely right. That was at one of my lowest points in my marriage where I just had no voice.

Michelle Johnson: And I, and I just didn’t even know who I was and what I wanted in life and I had to figure that out. And unfortunately, the only way that we could figure that out is by separating and go in our separate ways. I think we’re most happy, you know, we’re happier, much happier now, my [00:15:00] ex husband and I apart. Um, and he was able to really be himself with a different partner.

Michelle Johnson: And now I’m, I’m really finding my way, which is great. And and I feel like most of my happiness these days comes from helping others since I have been down that path and I know it, you know, far too well. You had mentioned the mask of perfection. So when I was conducting all these interviews with other leaders to figure out what does it take to be a connected leader at work and that first level of connection with self.

Michelle Johnson: So it’s first own your story. And really do a lot of work. I remember when I read the book, gifts of imperfection and Brené talked about, you have to own your story and not have any shame and not hide pieces and parts of yourself. And so immediately I thought, what a great exercise. And I started having my students own their story in the classroom.

Michelle Johnson: And yet still Judd, I was still so used to just putting one foot in front of the other and going, going, going. It, it, it, I realized [00:16:00] when I was listening to my students stories, I still didn’t know my own story. I still didn’t have a grasp of my story. So I had to own my story. I have all of my students and their stories and all of my leaders when I coach them, they own their story and they get rid of whatever shame they have.

Michelle Johnson: And, and, and they, they own their, their entire. life and their childhood and who they are and they own the struggles and the challenges. And then that second piece, again, going back, giving up perfection is what I learned. The second thing, so many of my leaders said they realized that no one was really pulling for them when they were so certain that they were perfect and wouldn’t show any flaws at all.

Michelle Johnson: And, and ultimately what then they did is they created a culture of fear. Rather than a culture of connection, because they demanded perfection from everybody who was around them because they expected it of themselves. And when you demand perfection of others, then others don’t feel comfortable speaking up, taking risks, so then you don’t have an innovative company.

Michelle Johnson: So it’s a very [00:17:00] easy equation. You can see, right, how somebody who’s so uncomfortable in their own skin demands that I just have to show up perfect, even though I’m not, and I’m going to pretend that I’m perfect. And then I. Demand perfection, everybody else. And then I’ve got a culture of fear. It’s just a really bad scenario.

Michelle Johnson: So that’s the second step of connection with self is giving up in PR or owning your imperfections and giving up perfection. And one of the other things that leaders said, and I’ll never forget, Tanya Tetlow was the president of Loyola at the time. She’s now the president of Fordham. She is just an amazing leader and she sings opera as well.

Michelle Johnson: And she said, I learned early on singing opera. I messed up a little bit, I realized the audience actually was pulling more for me, because they didn’t, they had empathy, they didn’t want to see me mess up, whereas if I just tried to be, pretend that I was perfect all the time, they weren’t necessarily pulling for me.

Michelle Johnson: I remember one of the other leaders that I interviewed, Larry Kloss, just said, It’s an incredible leader. And he said, Yeah, you know, some of [00:18:00] my best leadership lessons happened early on in my sports when I was still in school. And I realized when I screwed up rather than getting so angry and pretending that that didn’t happen.

Michelle Johnson: I went to my teammates and said, Man, can you help me? I’m really, I’m struggling in this area. Can you help? And then I interviewed Drew Brees, who at the time was the quarterback of the New Orleans Saints, our NFL team. And he said the same thing. He begins in the off season in order to connect with all of his offensive players.

Michelle Johnson: He takes out a notebook and a pen and he goes around to each person and he says, I want to help you. Here’s what I’m struggling with. And here’s my goal. And so can you help me and tell me what, what can I help you with? And he did it personally and professionally. So it wasn’t just on the field. He would also talk about his relationship with his wife, Brittany.

Michelle Johnson: He had four kids and he kept it all in a notebook. So, so I think what we’re learning here is in order to truly be a connected leader, human, we [00:19:00] have to really take time first to own our story, give up perfection and find commonality with others and enlist their help and say, Hey, life is a journey. Every day I’m trying to grow and evolve.

Michelle Johnson: Let’s do it together. Here’s what I’m working on. What are you working on? Let’s help each other. I think I now have three groups of people that I meet with. Um, yes, a group of all women. Most of them are all women, but advisory groups where we lift each other up and we get together once a month. Here’s what I’m working on.

Michelle Johnson: What are you working on? How can I help you? Here are my ideas. Judd, actually, I have four because you’re in one of them with our, um, cohort for impact 11. And those groups are so beautiful because we’re able to be vulnerable. We’re able to share. Here’s what I’m working on. We’re able to listen to other ideas.

Michelle Johnson: That’s connection. Yeah.

Judd Shaw: That was so amazing. And there’s so much I want to unpack there. The more I [00:20:00] owned my story, the more I was able to roll that in to my why, which made that purpose and passion and what, what we’re doing so much stronger for me. I didn’t feel the shame of it anymore. I no longer felt the guilt of it.

Judd Shaw: In fact, it, Seem like many of this had to happen for all of this now to happen to you. Also had me thinking that you have. Um, sort of a departure for your command and control approach to teaching authentic human connection and, and promoting it, which produces last, lasting and longing effects. And for me, the first thing was, you know, what, who, who am I, right?

Judd Shaw: So when I went and [00:21:00] began my transformation out in California. I remember there was a moment where it was like, what do you want to do? How do you want to feel? What do you want to taste? What do you want to see? I started being intentional because I had never thought about what I wanted as opposed to this incredible craving to fit in and gain external validation.

Judd Shaw: And when I was able to stay there with that. I found myself going on the beach, watching the water come up and down, and the sun glist, sun setting and glistening as the water tide would go low and it would, the sand would sparkle. And I would stand there and it was this incredible moment that you remind me of, and I think that the, the feeling.

Judd Shaw: This incredible feeling like I can taste it. [00:22:00] I can smell where I was. I know what I was wearing in that moment in August of 2020. And I think that that moment, to your point, was being in touch with the first time with my most authentic self.

Michelle Johnson: Thank you for taking me there. That was really beautiful. And it was such vivid imagery of the sand and the sun and the sparkle and just finally being honest and being real and being present and, and, and not having to, as you said, get, receive external validation to make you feel whole to, to find validation within.

Michelle Johnson: And that’s the real key here, right? And it is, it’s spending a lot of time. And I hope that your listeners can pick up on that, that, that the only way that we got to this point where we’re really, truly helping others is we had to spend a whole lot of [00:23:00] time unpacking what had happened in our past, owning it, not being ashamed of it, recognizing that that’s.

Michelle Johnson: how we grew. That was a challenge that was put in our life. But let’s focus on how we were resilient and how we overcame that challenge, incorporating that into our story rather than shying away from it, reflecting, appreciating, having gratitude for what we’ve gone through. Um, being able to have a mindset that’s not victim.

Michelle Johnson: That’s huge to get out of that victim mindset and say, you know what? This is who I am and it makes me different and different as good. Okay. And, and so I want your listeners to understand that that true connection with self takes a lot of time and dedication and a lot of time journaling and a lot of time, whether it’s sitting in the sand or wherever your, you know, place in nature is to really kind of get back in touch with yourself.

Michelle Johnson: So my third thing that I learned through all of my interviews about [00:24:00] connection with self is. owning your style too. So I have this assessment called the communication preference profile and whatever assessment you take, there are so many communication assessments out there. Just figure out by taking some assessments of how you show up in the world.

Michelle Johnson: You know, we show up differently. And, and particularly when it comes to connection, because I’m renaming that assessment, the connection assessment. When it comes to connection, I show up as, and this is I think you too, if you were to take it Judd, for so long I showed up just as action. I was an achievement junkie.

Michelle Johnson: And I think you and I were both looking for external validation, trying to fit in. And so as achievement, you know, junkies, we just, I was just going, going, going. So the best part of my day was checking off the to do list. So I, I mean, I even had colleagues that would tell me, yeah, like I would try to pop into your office, Michelle, but man, you shoot me out.

Michelle Johnson: You had stuff to do. I said, gosh, you are so right. I was just so action. It’s called action [00:25:00] focused in my communication. Whereas a high people person really places value and puts time towards relationships. And I had to relearn how to do that in order to be much better at connection because I just was just moving forward.

Michelle Johnson: Forward momentum was the key to me, but forward momentum wasn’t bringing me the connection that That was, um, that brought joy to my life at all, you know, achievement, as you know, because you, you achieve the most. I mean, you had your face all over billboards and you had all of the luxury goods to show it right.

Michelle Johnson: The money, the boats, the cars, the airplanes. Um, so you had, you had achieved it and then had to look inside and say, am I really happy? Right, right. That that wasn’t really truly bringing you happiness. And so again, we, we have to spend a lot of time getting to know ourselves first. And once you do that, then you show up authentically in the world, [00:26:00] then you can meaningfully connect with others.

Michelle Johnson: And then that’s where the satisfaction is. Faction and fulfillment comes, it comes through others. I should have brought the big pile of books that are downstairs on my island in my kitchen. I mean, Judd, I think in the past two weeks I’ve got nine books that have all been written about connection. Yeah, from authors like David Brooks, who’s typically, you know, he’s a he’s a columnist and he’s typically talking about politics And he just wrote a book to know oneself or to connect to know others to connect better and to show up better I mean It seems like we are definitely on to something that there is this epidemic of loneliness and disconnected and Disconnection and Vivek Murthy our u.

Michelle Johnson: s. Journalist Surgeon General wrote a book that Dr. Bob Waldinger, the longest study at Harvard, everyone of who’s trying to make a difference in the world is saying, we are in a really bad spot and we know what the answer is and the [00:27:00] answer is true science. Meaningful connection.

Judd Shaw: Yeah, I can’t remember exactly Brooks the name of the book.

Judd Shaw: I know it’s a red cover I ordered it to it’s on my kitchen and one of these Books that I plan on reading on one of these weeks to shut down and just get some some me time with the books But you know people pleasing Perfectionism success Achievement, you know, these were all coping mechanisms for me, too.

Judd Shaw: These were masks that I wore in order to not feel the shame, the guilt to fit in, not be judged, to be liked, uh, to be praised. So all of those for me were cloaking. These behaviors were really the masks that I was wearing, um, you know, just as much as other people can wear ones with drugs and alcohol [00:28:00] and gambling and sex, pornography, internet, whatever they are, they’re all things that are taking us away from ourselves.

Judd Shaw: And you know, you reminded keynote, uh, out in California and I was up there. And at one point I realized. That I had used the clicker on my slide deck and I was going the wrong way. And by the time I looked over to this big screen to left and the big screen to the right, I’m three slides behind my, my keynote, right?

Judd Shaw: And all I did on that moment was capture the humanness of it, the vulnerability of it. I mean, I’m talking on human connection. Let’s connect. I said, wow, look at that. Uh, I’ll figure this thing out at some point. And everybody laughed and everybody [00:29:00] kicked back and everybody had a sense of, ah, a lot of this stuff is sometimes heavy stuff.

Judd Shaw: That’s a break in a moment. A lighthearted, a warm-hearted, a connecting humanness to it, and picking up on that about a half hour into it. I started like, you know, I need to water. And so I looked around and I realized that the table wasn’t set up that way for this keynote with a water bottle, but I had one off stage.

Judd Shaw: So I asked permission if I could just step off for a second to get a bottle. I get back on stage. I drink the water and I’m like so much and everybody again. Laughed. And had this moment that I connected with the audience and it was then that I realized that these moments don’t drive disconnection. In fact, when I’m more human, more vulnerable, more [00:30:00] honest.

Judd Shaw: More apt to make a mistake, own it like it’s my story and move forward. I’m more likely to connect with others.

Michelle Johnson: Well, you’re absolutely right. All of a sudden you had the audience going, Oh, thank goodness. He’s not perfect. He’s more like me. I’m like him. Oh, good. I need water too. Sometimes I don’t get the clicker right either.

Michelle Johnson: Oh, thank goodness. Yeah, you’re human and you were able to admit that and, and I wrote a, about a, a time and I wrote about this in my book early on in my teaching. I had it in my head that I had to be perfect and I had in my head that being, um, all powerful was the way to go in the classroom that never give up your powerful.

Michelle Johnson: Don’t ever say, give up your power. Don’t ever say you’re sick. Don’t tell them you’re sick. Don’t ever say you made a mistake. It was kind of, you know, that, that’s the old command and control. And so there was a night in a. I was lecturing, I was teaching on nonverbal communication and my [00:31:00] heel just flew off.

Michelle Johnson: I mean, spiraled. Thank goodness didn’t hit anybody in the lip because I’ve seen that happen before. Um, so I didn’t bloody anybody, but now all of a sudden my shoes 6 feet, 8 feet away. And rather than laughing and being human, I just pretended it didn’t happen. I wobbled over, over, put my shoe back on and I kept lecturing.

Michelle Johnson: And the, the, like my students were just giggling and what an opportunity back then for me just to laugh too and say, well, let’s talk about that nonverbal communication, like how do you handle that in the middle of a speech? But instead I, and the script in my head was, Don’t let them see you sweat. Don’t let them see you sweat.

Michelle Johnson: Don’t give up power. And gosh, I wish I could go back and just show them that being human is so much better. What a missed opportunity. But I was young.

Judd Shaw: Um, you though use a framework to teach [00:32:00] authentic human connection and building it to organizations and executives and team leaders. And oftentimes we say to people, bring yourself out Bring your best self to work or, you know, be your best version.

Judd Shaw: And for me, again, at some point, I, I, I didn’t even know what that looked like. I didn’t even know I, I didn’t want to go to beach, sit on the sidewalk or for taco. I don’t know, but I really listened to myself and I use that as my guide. And so when I re engineered my healing after my transformation, about two years, I thought, how can I put it into a framework?

Judd Shaw: Where others could understand the steps that I took to find Judd was, as you pointed out, I can’t connect with others if I can’t connect with myself. How can I love someone else if I don’t love [00:33:00] myself? And so. At the ultimate doing research and speaking to professionals and my own experiences and all my different forms of therapies and learning, I ultimately put together the Connection Cure.

Judd Shaw: Cure standing for conscious awareness, which means knowing that we’re showing up in the world, masked up, that there are some places Where we are still not our authentic selves, sometimes even with people we know really well. So why is that? So it’s a first thing is being aware that you’re not genuine, you’re not being completely authentic.

Judd Shaw: And the second one is the you and cure is understanding. So that is understanding the reasons we [00:34:00] mask up. Maybe for some it’s a loss of a loved one when they were young. Maybe it was a childhood trauma, emotional neglect like it was for me. Um, you know, our caregivers or society taught us that we couldn’t be ourselves.

Judd Shaw: Maybe it was a list of things, but understanding the root of that is your ability. To address it can’t fix a problem that you don’t know it. The third part is then renewing, which as, and I wholeheartedly love what you said, which is for me under renewing is connecting with yourself first and then connecting with others as that true self.

Judd Shaw: And then lastly is the E for expanding, which is how can we now take this new ability. of our authentic version and deepen those connections [00:35:00] that we have and expand them out into the world that we live, work, love, and play. And so that’s sort of like, for me, those rings, each of those steps is the step to deep connection with yourself first and with and your framework, which is based on three sort of crucial tiers, if you would, um, are this is the same authentic human connection when you break it down.

Judd Shaw: But this is a beautiful way because I’m showing individuals. And in this way, you’re showing actually teams or departments or organizations The same effect. Can you walk me through that?

Michelle Johnson: Absolutely. So what I discovered again, in all of my interviews, cause I, I also want your listeners to know, I think it’s very clear now that Jed and I didn’t come out of the womb as, as brilliant connectors.

Michelle Johnson: [00:36:00] We, you know, we had to really live our lives. We had to struggle. We had to fall down. We had to get back up and then figure it out. And so in all of my interviews, when, when I got to the, so we all, we’ve already deconstructed that first level for leaders. is connection with self and spending all that time in order then to get to level two, which is connection with your team.

Michelle Johnson: And what I found is that, and this is very Jesuit cause you know, I’ve been at Loyola for over 20 years, which is a Jesuit university. And in the, one of the Jesuit philosophies is show up, treat others as full Versions of themselves. Full humans show care and compassion for each individual as a full human.

Michelle Johnson: And so that’s step number one of connection with your team is leaders need to recognize that the people on their team are not just numbers and what they bring to the bottom line. Treat them as full humans. In bed connection questions to your team [00:37:00] meetings. So not only you can go deeper and get to know them on a personal level, but so they can get to know each other.

Michelle Johnson: I’ll give you an example. We have a brand new Dean Bobby Savoy, and he’s never been in academia. So our Dean went on and and and. And he was the president of our board of trustees. He’s formed three companies, sold them all for millions and millions and millions of dollars and, and thought, I love Loyola.

Michelle Johnson: They need a Dean. Why don’t I be a Dean for a little bit? So he’s our interim Dean. And the very first faculty meeting, Judd, this is crazy. After 20 years, we’ve never done anything like this. I know my colleagues. I’ve worked with them for 20 years. I know them as colleagues. He asked us to show up with 1 slide and to talk about what brings us joy to share pictures of our Children.

Michelle Johnson: What we like to do is hobbies. And that was his very 1st introduction to us. And let me tell you, that was my 1st introduction after 20 years of. To my colleagues at a more meaningful level, and I didn’t [00:38:00] even tell him to do that. Right. Usually, like, usually I’m the one who tells leaders, okay, first begin with something that goes personal.

Michelle Johnson: That was brilliant. So that’s the first step in connection with your team is you have to embed time in your rhythm in order to provide opportunities to connect. And that’s, you do that with connection questions. So the second. Yeah, go ahead.

Judd Shaw: You jump there. Uh, one of the examples that I can offer is at, um, we do one of two things.

Judd Shaw: So I have a smaller team that I work with within our organization and every morning we start with a connection card. And you can buy these on Amazon. There’s boxes and boxes of them for couples, for individual, whatever. It doesn’t really matter. Cause you can always play mix a question, but we do that. So I’ll, I’ll shuffle the deck and I’m like, uh, I’d stop there.

Judd Shaw: Okay. Left or right left. What is driving. [00:39:00] Passion for you today and they’ll answer then the next personal answer next and then I’ll answer and that’s the connection card. And we do that every day in summer. Interesting. What’s what’s holding you back from meeting your goals? You know, but you learn and our team and that drives that connection.

Judd Shaw: We’re using literal connection cards in the meeting. And the other thing we’ve done is do name tags, but on your name tag, you just have to put something you want people to know about you, but not your name, like dog owner, horse lover, you know, marathon. And sort of like, in other words, we see Pat past a name or a title.

Judd Shaw: We see something it’s, it’s about you. We hearing and we’re seeing the you, you, so that those are a couple of things we do and I love that.

Michelle Johnson: Thank you so much for sharing, Judd. I love collecting [00:40:00] ideas like that because that’s one of the ways now what my mission is, is to now help leaders and organizations do the connecting.

Michelle Johnson: You know, my, my book was all about, okay, here’s what I found in all of my research. Here’s what, here’s the definition of connection to be seen, heard, seen, heard, valued, respected, appreciated. So we’re able to figure out that’s the definition of connection. Okay. And then what’s What does it look like? Three levels, right?

Michelle Johnson: And so I’m in the second level right now of connecting with team. It’s, yes, it’s first show up as a full human and make sure that your people feel seen, heard, valued, respected, and appreciated. And how do you do that? You begin by asking questions and finding the commonality and building bridges. I’ll never forget during the pandemic, we were on a zoom call with and I was coaching one of my leaders and he said, okay, I’m gonna, um, Ask everybody just on a scale of one to 10, how are they doing and why?

Michelle Johnson: I said, okay, fair enough. And one of the guys said, I’m, I’m, I’m like a three. I just became an empty nester [00:41:00] and this was horrible. And my leader, who is a chief said, oh my gosh, I had no idea. I just became an empty nester. Let’s talk in our next one on one. I can, I can empathize. And it’s times like that.

Michelle Johnson: Again, the reason why you do that in a team meeting, because I have some leaders who say, Michelle, I’ll get personal and ask those questions in one on ones. I don’t need to spend time in a team meeting. We’ve got things to accomplish in our agenda. And I said, well, let’s back up because connection drives results.

Michelle Johnson: That’s my tagline. That’s what I’ve realized that if you embed time for your team to truly. Become safe with each other, vulnerable with each other, share more than just how’s the weather, how you do. And then that drives the trust and then you can go big and that’s where the results will come in, but you have to embed that time and, and so that you get to know each other more.

Michelle Johnson: So that’s number one, show up. And show your people that you care about them as a full human. Number two, listen first. And so what I’m trying to tell my [00:42:00] leaders to do in their team meetings, the old command and control style was all about talking. It was all about, you know, communicating was more transactional.

Michelle Johnson: Here’s what I need you to do. Any questions? No. Okay. And now like let’s create an environment of connection where it’s much more about listening. So you as the leader, wait last talk and first ask a question that goes deeper, get them, you know, feeling safe and getting to know each other and then have them share updates on the projects and then ask them to, you know, what can we do to help each other?

Michelle Johnson: And then at the very end, come in and give your updates. So. The second tenet under connection with your team is listen first in order to lead. And then the third one, which I learned was much more, the, this seismic shift in leadership is really becoming more of a leader as a servant leader, a leader as a coach, a leader, as somebody that’s there just to remove barriers.

Michelle Johnson: to ask questions and to bring it out in you and develop [00:43:00] you. So it’s a very different orientation. And then ultimately, as you said, there are three tiers. The top level of connection, at least as far as I’ve gone in an organization, is the connection with your organization. So I was really struggling with this, Judd.

Michelle Johnson: I was thinking, before

Judd Shaw: you go on to the connection with. Uh, you have, so you have three parts of the connection with self, right? And those parts are

Michelle Johnson: owning your story, give up perfection, own your communication style.

Judd Shaw: Then from there you can move to connection with team. And those again have three sub parts and they are

Michelle Johnson: show care and compassion as, as, as your people are, are full humans.

Michelle Johnson: Listen to lead first and show up as a servant leader.

Judd Shaw: You know, with those last two, for me, it reminds me that I felt that any great [00:44:00] meeting in our organization, even others is when you can walk in and you cannot identify the leader. That’s, that’s a great meeting. That’s where people feel they can raise their hand, foster, Advice, feedback, give suggestions, surface problems, tell the business or the company their feelings if it’s heading into a direction they’re not comfortable with, but really.

Judd Shaw: Engaging in your team, you know, enter a meeting, not be able to identify who the CEO, president, founder, blah, blah, blah, is you, you got a really good meeting. And that second part to that, um, was that I now realize that my job is not to do. Your job is to teach you how to do your job and so that when I come around, [00:45:00] my questions would be, how can I help you?

Judd Shaw: How can I support you? Is there anything you need from me? You know, that’s a different dynamic when I connect with my team to your points, to your framework. In that way, I know that my, my culture is higher. My productivity is higher efficiency, less mistakes. You just, we’re just running on a higher engine.

Michelle Johnson: Oh, I love that. And I love that you just mentioned the results that you’re trying to go after. Right. Efficiency, retention, productivity. Those are whatever results that you can identify is what you’re going after. If you can do it, you can do it through connection. At least it would give you a much better chance of getting there and achieving your results.

Michelle Johnson: You’re absolutely right. And I love how you talked about how, how you show up as a servant leader, that your job is to coach. Your job is to coach them [00:46:00] and, and to say, how can I support you? What do we, what do you need from me? How can I help you? And let me help you through my questioning, through the questions that I ask.

Michelle Johnson: I’m not going to ask you, why did you do that? I’m going to say, what do you think? Okay. I wonder if what are some obstacles you’re facing? What do you really want in this? And it’s your questioning as a leader, which will help develop them so that you can pull up and be your highest version and be a very strategic leader in order to do that, you have to pull up and allow your, your people to lead right.

Michelle Johnson: And that’s, that’s very hard for people to do and not micromanage. And so I, so I, that’s the real transition is you as a leader in order to pull up, you’ve got to develop your people and give them confidence that they actually do know what to do. And they do have the answers and show them the support that it, that they’ve got it.

Judd Shaw: I can fly 35, 000 feet at much more efficiency. I can come down to the tarmac every once in a while. But, you know, your front line, managers, supervisors, [00:47:00] when everybody is connected, you know, leadership can stay there because they’re leading from an authentic standpoint, from a servant standpoint, and things on the ground just get done.

Judd Shaw: But that, that’s connection with. Self that’s connection with team. But for you, we have that final element that goes into connection with organization. Tell me about it. Yeah, that was

Michelle Johnson: a real struggle for me because I didn’t know how in the world you connect with the organization. And so I remember being in, um, one of the CEO’s office and his name is Warner Thomas, and he’s now the CEO of Sutter health out in California.

Michelle Johnson: And I said, I said, Warner, help me out here. How in the world do you connect with 40, 000 employees? He goes, I can tell you that’s an easy one. I said, do tell. He said, you must own your calendar. Owning your calendar is true connection with your organization. And how you do that is first, as a leader, you identify the [00:48:00] key stakeholders necessary for you to be successful.

Michelle Johnson: Who are the key stakeholders you need? Then you have to figure out your rhythm. How often should you be meeting with them? In what form? Should it be one on one? Should it be team? Should it be, what is the cadence? And he said, once you get the rhythm in place, and then as a, you know, he said, you mentioned, Michelle, how do I connect with 40, 000 people?

Michelle Johnson: He said, then I’ve got to go. That’s my, my weekly, my monthly rhythm. Then I have to pull way out and figure out how to do these huge meetings. So now once a year, we bus in the thousands of employees from all over so that they can personally hear my strategic message, my vision, what our goals are, what our priorities are.

Michelle Johnson: I Now this, a lot of leaders do that now through video and put it on the website. But this particular leader really did spend the money to bus everybody in across this entire region in the convention center to hear from him and to be able to [00:49:00] ask him any questions. So, so owning your calendar is absolutely crucial.

Michelle Johnson: In order to connect with your company. And he said, he said, it really irks him when his leaders come to him and complain, I don’t have any time to do my job. All I’m in are meetings all day. He said, well, then you’ve lost control of your calendar because your calendar is now owning you. And let me give you something too, that I’ve learned Judd, when I just got back, not just got back, but I went to this great thinkers 50 gala for the top, 50 thinkers in the world.

Michelle Johnson: And, and where we are now is not even with meeting management. We’re calling it connection management, interaction management, energy management. So, so owning your calendar, I mean, we really have to disrupt. Do we have to meet in a conference room every time? Probably not. Can we do more connection walks and get outside?

Michelle Johnson: Probably so. I now just conduct a lot of my coaching calls with my earbuds in and I’ll ask, I’ll say, Hey, do you want to get some [00:50:00] steps in? I’ll put my buds in and I’ll walk around the park and you’re in California. Do you want to do the same? Absolutely. And it was a struggle in the beginning because I felt, Oh, gosh, I’m giving up that face to face on zoom.

Michelle Johnson: But yet. There’s so much creativity that comes when you’re moving your body and you’re out in nature and you’re talking through it. In any case, the point is owning your calendar is crucial and there are so many different ways these days that you can do that. So that’s number one, owning your calendar.

Michelle Johnson: The second way you connect with your organization is making sure that you truly are aligned with the company goals. And I have a lot of stories in my book of leaders who ended up quitting their jobs. They quit their jobs during the pandemic. They quit their jobs during right after nine 11, because they realized that they were, which I think you had one of those moments of, Oh my gosh, what am I doing all of this for?

Michelle Johnson: I don’t even believe in the company mission. This isn’t who I want to be and that was what happened with the great [00:51:00] resignation, right? A lot of these employees said, I have a jerk boss who I hate. He doesn’t even know he or she doesn’t even know who I am and doesn’t value me. I’m not doing this anymore.

Michelle Johnson: So alignment is key. Making sure that you really are aligned with the company’s values. Owning your calendar. And the third one I really learned from Todd Graves, who is the founder of Raising Cane’s Chicken, and he has been on a global expansion tour these past couple of years, took off during the pandemic.

Michelle Johnson: He’s all over the world now, and he said, you know, I looked around. I wanted to open up a chicken finger, um, Raising canes and I realized my competition was McDonald’s and Burger King. And so I went in and I saw that their workers weren’t very happy. And so I tried to figure out why, well, they were wearing polyester uniforms that they didn’t like.

Michelle Johnson: They were listening to music that they didn’t like, and they were having to follow scripts that they didn’t like. He said, so I wanted to create a positive culture that was fun. So if you go through the raising canes drive through, I tell them just [00:52:00] joke around with the customers begin with clock clock.

Michelle Johnson: He goes, you pick your uniforms. Let’s have fun. And so whenever you see Todd Graves now, he is all about promoting artists and, um, and, and entertainment. And let’s just create a positive culture where you feel good. So that was the third thing. Connection with your organization as a leader is, is really creating this positive.

Michelle Johnson: Positive environment where your people can thrive and have fun.

Judd Shaw: Such an amazing framework. I have to tell you, this conversation has reminded me of exactly why I felt so deeply connected to you from the very beginning when we first spoke, and that is you’re just so authentic. You’re so real and raw.

Judd Shaw: You’re so amazingly intelligent and confident and, and deeply understanding. And nonjudgmental and all of these sort of [00:53:00] characteristics allow for a conversation that feels so heartwarming, so real, and so beautiful. And I can’t thank you enough.

Michelle Johnson: Oh, Judd, that was just the kindest. Thank you so much for, for that compliment.

Michelle Johnson: And I feel the same way. Thank you for having me on your podcast. I loved our conversation. Um, you asked beautiful questions and to all of your listeners, thank you so much for tuning in. And we want you to be a part of our movement, right? We really are trying, Judd and I are trying to make a difference in the world by teaching and showing people how to do it.

Michelle Johnson: to connect more meaningfully with themselves so that they can connect more meaningfully with others. Um, cause that’s what brings real satisfaction and joy. So thank you so much.

Judd Shaw: You know, last question for you. You have been featured in Forbes, um, recognized and honored as city business woman of the year.

Judd Shaw: Uh, you have been recognized [00:54:00] as one of the most influential. Figures in New Orleans, uh, you’re doing so much on human connection with organization, some of the largest in the world. How in the end does Dr. Michelle Johnston best authentically connect with herself?

Michelle Johnson: You know, I was thinking today, um, as I put on this pink dress in honor of the upcoming Easter weekend, that I am so looking forward to Thursday, getting on airplane and meeting my daughter.

Michelle Johnson: And my father and my brother and sister in law and nieces and nephews at our Lake Place in South Carolina and just disconnecting one of the things that I’ve learned the most about connection as as high level leaders is we have to be We have to disconnect in order to be good to ourselves. And so I was just thinking, gosh, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, I get to truly [00:55:00] disconnect and spend time in nature with my family and I can’t wait.

Judd Shaw: What’s one of the favorite activities that, uh, the family tradition does at the lake?

Michelle Johnson: Oh, my brother has a pontoon boat at my dad’s dock and my dad has a pontoon boat. And we just love, it’s a 650 square miles of shoreline. It’s a massive freshwater lake. And we just love circling the lake and watching the sunset and the birds and nature.

Michelle Johnson: It’s just beautiful. It’s gorgeous. It’s good for the soul.

Judd Shaw: I hope you have the most incredible, most connecting, most joyful time. And again, I love your support, your energy, your thought leadership. You are a beautiful human being. Thank you for coming on the show.

Michelle Johnson: Thank you so much, Judd. Right back at ya.

Michelle Johnson: Take care.

Judd Shaw: I want to extend my deepest gratitude to you. If you’ve enjoyed this episode, [00:56:00] please follow us on your favorite platform or share this episode with a friend. You can also follow me on Instagram at Judd Shaw official. A special thank you to personal injury law firm, Judd Shaw Injury Law, for their support Support in helping us bring this podcast to life.

Judd Shaw: Remember, friends, authenticity isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being real. It’s about embracing our vulnerabilities, celebrating our strengths, and owning our stories. Until next time.