Embracing Endings & New Beginnings | Jesse Israel
Judd Shaw
Jesse Israel
Episode Summary
Jesse Israel and Judd Shaw explore the art of honoring closing chapters—whether a marriage, career, or identity—and creating fertile ground for new growth. Drawing from Jesse’s nine‑year journey with The Big Quiet, they discuss practices like ceremony, emotional release, and ritual to consciously move through transitions. Jesse emphasizes intuitive listening, tending to the “soil” between chapters, and letting go without shame. The conversation offers actionable insights for meditation, resilience, and navigating profound life shifts.
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Episode BONUS
Judd Shaw welcomes meditation teacher and entrepreneur Jesse Israel to discuss the natural cycles of endings and beginnings. Jesse begins by leading a grounding meditation, drawing attention to the body, breath, and environment, setting the tone for the conversation. They dive into common myths about meditation—clarifying that thinking isn’t failure, but engagement with the process. Jesse explains unlocking meditation by trying different techniques and embodying practice to influence loved ones without pushing it onto them.
The heart of the episode centers on embracing the closing of life chapters. Judd shares his impending divorce and the emotional tumult of major life shifts, and asks Jesse how to ritualize milestones like letting go of past identities. Jesse highlights his experience with The Big Quiet: holding a public farewell, making a film, Times Square billboard, and writing a personal letter—rituals that invited community closure and allowed his next chapter to begin. He underscores the importance of grieving, crying, and letting go of shame to open space for new energy.
They explore how to identify the intuitive sense when a cycle ends, emphasizing meditation and emotional attunement as tools for clarity. Jesse stresses the role of trust in bigger life patterns and recognizing historical evidence that releasing leads to growth. They discuss cultivating the “soil”—self‑care, joy, and patience—between chapters, instead of rushing toward a new flower. Jesse shares how, after closing one venture, he planted seeds through community meditation before The Big Quiet emerged.
The episode concludes with Jesse encouraging Judd to write his own closure letter and invite others to bear witness, anchoring endings in ceremony and moving into new beginnings with presence, clarity, and energetic readiness.
5 Lessons from the Episode:
- Mindfulness myth: Meditation isn’t about emptying the mind—it’s about practicing awareness where thoughts arise.
- Lead by being: Your own transformation is the most effective invitation for others to follow.
- Ritual closure: Monumental endings deserve ritual—a letter, ceremony, public acknowledgment.
- Trust cycles: Past experiences show that trust and letting go pave the way for new growth.
- Cultivate soil: In transitions, focus on nourishing yourself—the flower comes in its own season.
CHAPTERS:
00:00 Guided Meditation & Introduction
01:20 Debunking Meditation Myths
04:42 Teaching Meditation & Building Habit
10:00 Recognizing Cycles & Honoring Endings
14:33 How Jesse Closed The Big Quiet
19:25 Ceremony & Grief in Transitions
24:15 Overcoming Attachment & Fear
27:26 Anchoring Intuition & Trust
29:41 Cultivating Soil Between Chapters
32:47 Advice for Crafting Closure & Ceremony
Guest This Week:
Jesse Israel
Known for founding The Big Quiet movement and leading some of the largest meditations on earth, Jesse is a renowned expert in human performance & wellbeing, a global keynote speaker and a leadership coach to today’s highest performing business people and public figures. From guiding mass meditations in sold-out arenas on tour with Oprah Winfrey to becoming a 5X audible bestseller, Jesse has inspired audiences of millions around the world with his message of mindfulness and leadership. Formerly a record label and tech fund founder, Jesse blends his entrepreneurial experience with his wellbeing expertise to help leaders, teams and organizations elevate their performance from within.
Known for founding The Big Quiet movement and leading some of the largest meditations on earth, Jesse is a renowned expert in human performance & wellbeing, a global keynote speaker and a leadership coach to today’s highest performing business people and public figures. From guiding mass meditations in sold-out arenas on tour with Oprah Winfrey to becoming a 5X audible bestseller, Jesse has inspired audiences of millions around the world with his message of mindfulness and leadership. Formerly a record label and tech fund founder, Jesse blends his entrepreneurial experience with his wellbeing expertise to help leaders, teams and organizations elevate their performance from within.
Show Transcript
Jesse Israel 00:00
quiet doesn’t define who I am the big quiet will always be a part of me and the man that I am and regardless of what I’m doing or not doing what doesn’t change is me and so much of who I am comes from the experiences in my life and all of those life experiences regardless of how long they last for how long the success is for they shape me and that nobody takes away from me and that goes towards whatever I do next.
Judd Shaw 00:36
Jesse, I’m so grateful you’re here.
Jesse Israel 00:40
Thanks for having me brother, I’ve been looking forward to this.
Judd Shaw 00:43
really, really grateful. Thank you for your time. Um, you know, you started a major movement in meditation, the big quiet, it’s come to, um, to its close and we’ll talk about that. And, but the heart of it was that was meditation. And I wanted to know if, if you could lead us in a very sort of short meditation that would help us sort of set into the conversation for clarity and, and purpose and direction. What do you think?
Jesse Israel 01:20
I love that idea.
Judd Shaw 01:20
Let’s do it. Let’s do it. Okay.
Jesse Israel 01:23
All right. Great. So if you’re comfortable doing so, go ahead and close your eyes. And as we settle into the practice, just take a moment to notice the sounds of the studio that we’re in. You might hear the buzzing of the lights, sounds from off of set, maybe a little bit of a background noise from the street. Whatever those sounds are, just welcome them in, noticing them. They’ve been here this whole time, but we likely haven’t stopped to actually bring attention to them. And as we settle into those sounds, into that subtle quiet, bring your attention to your chest. Just notice how your body breathes by itself, how your chest gently rises and falls. Noticing your heart space. Notice any emotions or sensations that you might be feeling in your heart. And whatever you might be feeling, just allow yourself to feel it, just to be with it without resisting or judging. When we let ourselves feel whatever we’re feeling, it’s like opening up a window and letting in a fresh breeze of air. And now that we’re in tune with the sounds around us, in tune with our body and our emotions, you can take a moment to slowly blink open your eyes. And we’re reset. And we’re ready to go. Yes.
Judd Shaw 03:39
Wow. You know, I know meditation in my daily practice has wonders in my life, in clarity, in my nervous system. It’s just everything every day I couldn’t go without it. And that wasn’t a time in my life, you know, where I was always doing meditation was always recent. And as I’ve gotten more and more into it, I want to be able to show my loved ones, you know, my kids and, um, but I find that the, the answer that I get often is I can’t meditate or that one doesn’t work for me for people who want to get into it. And there are so many standing and walking with, what’s, what would you recommend is how to explore meditation and also how can I teach it?
Jesse Israel 04:42
Yeah. Yeah, when it comes to exploring meditation, I’d like to start by really encouraging people to understand that there’s a general misconception around meditation. And it’s that to meditate means that we are not thinking. To meditate means that the mind is silent, that the body’s relaxed. And that if we’re doing that, we’re meditating, we’re being a good meditator. And if we’re not, we’re a bad meditator, or we can’t meditate. And this is a misconception. There’s a very, very small percentage of people that can just close their eyes and silent their mind like that. You know, living in 2024, the amount of information that we process today is so great. You know, we have a different thought roughly every six seconds. So we have to be realistic when we come into practice and understand that to try to make ourselves not think is likely gonna make us actually think more. A lot of science shows that there’s as much benefit when we’re practicing and thinking as when we’re practicing and in that calmer, you know, more zen doubt state. So I really invite people to shift the mindset and understand that if the mind’s wandering in practice, it doesn’t mean that they’re doing it wrong. It actually means that it’s working, they’re getting the benefit, the stress is being released. It’s just about understanding that that’s part of the process. The other thing that I encourage people to do are to try different techniques. I really love a technique of meditation called the one giant mind technique. And there’s a free app that teaches people how to do it. There’s also the technique that I teach. And it’s not about quieting the mind. You know, it’s not about trying to make the mind be still. It’s about allowing for whatever comes up until ourselves move through it. And we think a sound, a mantra that comes from the Sanskrit language. And when we think it allows the mind and body to settle into a more relaxed state, regardless of if we’re thinking or not. So just reminding people that there are different ways to practice meditation as well. And when it comes to wanting to teach it, of course there are the obvious ways like doing meditation teacher trainings. But if it’s really just about getting people to buy in and be excited and want to practice because it’s this thing that’s so important to you, what I always recommend that people do is not push it on people. Meditation is one of these things where the more we push it on people, the more people push away from it. So I find that the best way to get people in our lives to become interested in meditation is to do it regularly ourselves and let people see the change that occurs in us, right? Become embodied in the benefit of the practice and people will start to notice the change. People will naturally become interested when they’re ready. And if we can almost attract people into the practice instead of trying to promote it on people, there’s a much more natural sort of energetic exchange that happens.
Judd Shaw 07:41
You know, as I think about my meditation practice, I watched it increase in terms of regularity through the day, which also means that maybe I’m going through more and more things, right? And those things for me are major life changes. Um, I’m approaching in, uh, in 2025, it’ll be my divorce trial after a five year divorce battle with kids involved. Um, I have my partner who will be, um, delivering our baby and I’ll have a new baby and be coming a new father. I mean, these are real life changes all within a month or two are happening. And so I’m meditating more and meditating more because I’m, I’m trying to find a way to be able to close versions of my, in my life and give them the proper honoring and also being mindful and have inner peace about the new chapters that I’m starting. You know, for me, it made me think about how four years ago when I went on a transformation and, and I, I called it my, my dark night in my soul where, where a version of me really died, totally died, but I didn’t have a cemetery. I didn’t bury it. I didn’t, I didn’t have a ceremony and it didn’t have anyone over to make a shiva call for my former version, but there it was. And I just kind of moved on through life and I’m wondering did he miss that opportunity? And so for you, uh, wow, a nine year journey on the big quiet, which was so incredible leading, you know, some of the largest meditations in some of the coolest places on the planet, but come the summer, you decided that that journey had reached its, its end. And how do you know when to close something? When’s it the right time? And let’s, let’s focus on this first part about the closing chapters. How do I honor my divorce?
Jesse Israel 10:00
Yeah. Well, thanks, man, for being open about what’s real for you in your life right now. And I just got to say, I love that you’re thinking about this stuff through the lens of cycles, because everything in life, like everything in nature, is built around a cycle. Something is born, creation occurs, that thing grows for a period of time, and eventually at some point, the timeframe is always different, it returns back to the start and it’s ready to be complete. So good. And when nature’s cycle is complete, the next cycle is ready to be born. So I love that you’re naturally seeing that there’s something to that, because I think when we get outside of nature and we get into busy life in society, there’s a lot of shame around things closing. There’s a lot of shame around cycles completing. Especially when the timeline doesn’t line up with what we thought it was going to look like, for something like a marriage. When we go into the marriage, there’s a good chance that the two people getting married think they’re going to be together for a lifetime. And if something changes and that timeline is shorter than planned, that can be really painful. And with that, there can be a lot of shame or there can be the sensation of failure. And why I really like your question is because I think it’s so important for us to think if it’s a relationship, if it’s family dynamics, if it’s friendships, if it’s businesses, whatever it might be, there’s a timeline, there’s a cycle. And when it’s ready to be complete, the more we’re able to accept and embrace, and like you said, ritualize and celebrate the closing of the chapter, the more we are able to align with what nature naturally wants for us, which is for change to occur and for creation of something new to be born. So you asked, how do we become in touch with that? How do we get into that flow and that rhythm of the cycle of all things? And I’ve had two major career cycles like this in my life. I ran a record label for nine years from the age of 20 to 29. And then I ran the big quiet for nine years from the age of 30 to 39. And the first time I had that big transition of leaving this record label, this thing I started in my dorm room when I was a sophomore at NYU, and as it was really kind of picking up its growth, I felt like it was so clear that it was time to move on, which was so confusing. I had my practice of meditation as a tool that allowed me to not only hear that it was time, but to have the courage to act on it. So the first piece to this is, what are the tools and practices that we have in our lives that allow us to really hear and trust that deeper intuition? Because so much of understanding when it makes sense to make a change has to do with a deeper feeling. I believe that nature’s intelligence speaks through us through a fine level of feeling. It’s an intuitive feeling. It’s something we get in the gut. And for some people, it might take years before it’s clear that it’s time to act on that thing. For me, I started to get the feelings two years or so before we closed the Big Quiet that it was probably coming.
Jesse Israel 13:28
And it took me a year of putting the Big Quiet on a break and saying, let me just get a little breathing room here before we make any decisions. Because it was so scary to look at it. And then eventually reached a point going into this year where it became really clear that it was time. So I think part of this is, how do we have the tools and the practices that allow us to get clear? Can we give ourselves the time and the patience without rushing into it, without feeling any shame or pressure to let the feeling naturally emerge that we know it’s time? And then once we know that it is time, once we are ready to act on that change, what can we do to celebrate, ceremonialize, and ritualize that closing? So I think it actually would be really interesting and fun to think about and talk through ways you might do that as your divorce comes to a completion. Because there’s so much probably to grieve and to celebrate there. And if it’s helpful, I can share what I did for the Big Quiet as my way of closing that chapter and celebrating it so I could really open it to the next thing.
Judd Shaw 14:33
I’d love to hear it.
Jesse Israel 14:34
Yeah, so for us, there was so much excitement and popularity around the growth of the Big Quiet. Like you mentioned, we were doing mass meditations at a scale that really no one else was doing. By our five-year anniversary, we were touring with Oprah and filling arenas of people in silence. And it was the coolest thing. And I think because it was so unique and because it was of service to so many people, there was a lot of hype around it. So of course, so much of my identity was tied to doing this one thing. So when it became clear that it was time to say goodbye to it, I was really kind of stuck with, do I just let this quietly fizzle and just never really say anything and hope that people don’t really ask? Or do we really put it out there? Do we really say to our community of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people to say, we did this amazing thing together. We were able to create this because of you and what we were able to magically bring into existence through all of these times over nine years. And like we talked about, like you and I just talked about, in nature, there’s a cycle to all things. And it’s become very clear to us that the cycle of the Big Quiet is complete. So we wanna honor that. And in doing so, we made a short film, three-minute short film that celebrates the nine-year journey of the Big Quiet. And we shared that film. We screened that film. We blasted it out. We put it on our Instagrams and our social media feeds. And it was a way to tell the story and thank everyone that was involved. We also did a billboard at Times Square. New York City was where the Big Quiet was started. It was very much our home. So the billboard was a way to say, thanks NYC for getting quiet with us for all these years. We’re signing up, we’re saying goodbye. And the last thing I’ll mention that was so powerful for me was I wrote a letter to the Big Quiet. This was just the me and the Big Quiet thing. I wrote a letter to the Big Quiet, referring to the Big Quiet as you, saying, you taught me this. I learned this from you, you did this for me. And in that letter, was able to really celebrate our nine years, thank the Big Quiet for what it taught me, say goodbye and say, you’ll always be a part of me.
Judd Shaw 16:52
Hmm, I love that because for me, it sounds like you’re not only honoring this identity, this creature that you made into something, but also honoring all of those that were on the journey with you. You don’t steal it or rob it from them. Right. Who’s like, what happened to the big quiet? And so they get to celebrate along with you.
Jesse Israel 17:21
You nailed it. And I hadn’t considered how powerful that, what you just said would be. Because people would say to me, why not just keep it on the side? Who knows, maybe in a couple of years, you wanna bring it back, just let it be. And I considered that. But if I had taken that approach, what would have never happened would have been the closure that came that allowed hundreds and hundreds of people to reach out to us and to send messages and to write letters, sharing what the Big Quiet meant for them, getting photographs of babies, of couples that met through the Big Quiet events, to just hear about the impact. That was one of the most potent experiences of my life, to really be reminded of the impact of what this thing did in the world. And that wouldn’t have happened if we hadn’t publicly celebrated the closure.
Judd Shaw 18:12
Yeah. And allows all of those people to continue the journey with you into whatever your next is too, because now they know that part has come to a close. Yeah, you know, that’s so helpful. I think when I’m thinking about the divorce, there is a lot of things that, almost miracles that have come out of my divorce proceeding that in the beginning, I was fighting. In the beginning, I was struggling against, but all of these things that happened, had to happen exactly the way they had to happen. And so I think for me, one of the things I’d like to do is have a ceremony, you know, for that version of myself that I put away, that I laid down and said, this is no longer going to be me. But instead of just starting and being like, okay, I’m back in the game. And like I change clothes, having this real moment, because I think that that’s how the stepping stone to opening a new chapter.
Jesse Israel 19:25
Oh, it’s so spot on Judd, because we’re talking a lot about nature and nature cycles. When you do what you just said there, when you really ceremonialize and celebrate an ending, it honors nature cycle. And I believe that it just creates even more energy that flows in to that next chapter or to that next cycle. I think by celebrating the closing of something, we just enhance and boost up the energy for the thing that we’re now making space for. So I think that that process gets really supported.
Judd Shaw 19:58
Yeah. And that sounds like that process is applied to our personal and professional lives, changes of jobs. I mean, what we’re talking about are major life transitions. When one door closes, another opens. When the plant withers and dies, it fertilizes soil for something else to grow. When these new things grow, how do we celebrate properly the new start?
Jesse Israel 20:29
Well, I’ll tell you that probably the single most meaningful experience or practice that I had over this process of saying goodbye to the big quiet that allowed me to really open up into the joy and excitement of what’s next came from crying. You know, I had to learn how to allow myself to grieve what the big quiet was, what I thought it was going to be, the way that I was perceived, I could feel that changing. You know, when the big quiet was, you know, at its peak before we went on our break a couple of years ago, there was so much inbound, there was so much interest for the big quiet for me. And when we took our break, I really watched that slow down and it changed the way that I felt I was in the world. And it shifted these parts of my identity. And to a certain extent, I had to grieve that version of myself. And that was probably one of the hardest and most powerful things I’ve ever done to say, I’m consciously making a choice for this moment to take a break from some of the recognition, because it’s aligned with what I know I’m ready to do next. But in doing so, saying goodbye to some of that and then saying goodbye to some of that, missing what it felt like to be recognized and to be celebrated and to always be wanted. And it’s really what I needed because I needed the space to really get clear on the next thing. But to do that, I had some good cries about it, man, you know, some big, deep ones. And it was through some of that emotional purging and letting myself really feel the emotional change that on the other side of it, I was able to feel so solid, you know, so locked in, so clear that the big quiet doesn’t define who I am. The big quiet will always be a part of me and the man that I am. And regardless of what I’m doing or not doing, what doesn’t change is me. And so much of who I am comes from the experiences in my life and all of those life experiences, regardless of how long they last for, how long the success is for, they shape me. And that nobody takes away from me. And that goes towards whatever I do next. So I was able to take all of the energy and learning of that chapter of my life and be like, all right, now it’s time to go bring it to the next thing and to celebrate the next thing and feel excited about the next thing. So yeah, being with emotions, feeling emotions, you know, releasing the emotions that emerge and change, I think have so much to do with how we open up into what’s next. And then not being afraid to be public about this stuff, you know, to speak about this stuff. It’s so easy to feel shame around closing or for chapters ending and to not want to talk about it. And what I found was that by acknowledging it, it put it out to the universe that there’s change happening and that there’s new things opening and it’s created more energy, more excitement for what’s next.
Judd Shaw 23:32
You know, it sounds like there are people, and I imagine this to be an incredibly lonely place that had built an identity attached to something, and they just cannot close it, even though it doesn’t have the same aura, the vibe, the energy, and they’re holding onto it out of either this incredible fear of letting it die or what’s the next. Yes. What do you say to those, these people who are really deeply stuck in this unwillingness to release this identity when they just know it’s no longer the thing?
Jesse Israel 24:15
And it’s so common, what you’ve just described. And I think for a lot of people, they’ll go most their lives in that grip. And we do see this a lot in relationships and in careers. And not everybody has the means to be able to always take the leap. Right. So I think that’s always important to make room for that. But ultimately, I think there are two key pieces to it. One is understanding that everybody’s timeline for getting clear about when it’s time to take the leap is different. And that I think for so many of us, we need to go through extended periods of it being out of alignment for us to realize that it’s time to actually make the change. Sometimes we just have to really feel how unaligned something is to get to that place. And what I see is that when a cycle in nature is ready to be completed, and we’re not allowing for the completion to occur, and we’re holding on like you’ve described, nature will start to force the change. And this is when gnarly, uncomfortable stuff starts to occur. And sometimes we need those forces to get us to act on it.
Judd Shaw 25:28
You’re working against the universe, you just keep the exact way.
Jesse Israel 25:31
Act, whack. Exactly. And the harder people hold on, the harder the whacks. I noticed that in my first career transition, there were a lot more whacks. In the second career transition, 10 years later, I was able to more naturally trust in nature’s process, and I think align more with the flow of it. So less pain, less whacking. So yeah, so I think part of it is that, is just understanding that. And I think the other pieces is when people are really holding on tight, I like to ask them about what their relationship is to trust and faith and believing in a greater power or a greater energy that supports them. And there’s a lot of good that happens. There’s a lot that gets unpacked in that conversation because if somebody has lost connection with or relationship to their ability to trust in something greater, to trust in the natural unfolding of their life, that trust is lost, the grip and the holding on gets really tight. Absolutely. But if we can talk about ways that they can reestablish that deeper sense of trust and build more of that faith or knowingness within themselves, then the grip starts to loosen. And I find that different people have different practices or people or whatever it might be that allows them to come back into a place of trust.
Judd Shaw 26:50
Hmm. How, how do you, um, how would one anchor into, um, into the belief that, like, where they’re heading is the right thing. You know, they say purpose and passion and gut and what, like, for you, where do you dial that sense in? You know, some, some parts I would imagine, for me, it’s the meditations, the getting, just allowing space to have the clarity of what is next.
Jesse Israel 27:26
Yeah, you know, one thing that I find pretty consistently, and this is more so through my work mentoring people and coaching leaders, is that for most of us, the data’s there if we look back on our lives. So a lot of times I’ll say, think about a moment in your life where you felt similarly, right? Where the grip was really tight, you kind of lost your ability to trust that things were going to work out. What was that moment in your life previously where that happened? And what happened once you start, once you let go? What happened once you allowed yourself to open up to trust again? And pretty consistently, people are able to say, every time I’ve been in a situation like this and I’ve surrendered, it’s worked out. Consistently, people will say it. And even at the times where they let go and it led to something painful, it worked out. So, so much of this, people inherently know if we can get them to look back on their history and see how it’s been, how history has repeated itself for them when it comes to this time and time again. And sometimes all we need to do is be reminded of how it’s been proven to us that it exists in our lives to allow us to start to open up. Now, if you want to supercharge that, throw in a practice like meditation. You know, for me, like I mentioned, that gave me the clarity and the courage to act on it.
Judd Shaw 28:54
When somebody is closing their chapter, something, whether it be a major life transition or a work transition, there’s also times where that little sprout doesn’t come up right away. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I have felt like, uh-oh, where’s the growth? Where’s this next thing? The sun has risen and I don’t see anything coming from the ground. How do you find the patience in allowing that? In other words, I think that a lot of people would feel that just as that nature cycle happens, that just because something closes, something immediately opens. And sometimes you can close something without having your next game.
Jesse Israel 29:41
It’s very common to run with this thinking around the sprout, the seed sprouting and turning into a flower, yeah, the human desires is we want that thing to grow fast instantly. And again, not always the case, timeline’s always different just like it is in nature. And I think the best way to run with that metaphor is to understand that it’s not just about the growth of the seedling. It’s not just about the flower, it’s also about the soil. So when we’re in transitions, it’s so important that our focal point isn’t placed on the flower, it’s placed on the soil. What can we do to cultivate the healthiest possible soil and really farm that soil and prepare that soil for harvest? So what that’s looked like for me and a lot of people that I’ve worked with, it means just really doubling down on how we take care of ourselves, how we nurture ourselves, how we cultivate joy in the face of the unknown. And understand that by doing what we can to really focus on us and make that soil nutrient dense and rich, that with time, the seedlings will start to sprout. But that also goes back to trust, that also goes back to understanding that things aren’t always in our control, the timelines aren’t always in our control. When I left my record label, I was convinced that within three months, I’d have a concept for a tech startup that I’d raise a lot of money for and that I’d go bring to the world. And a year later, I was pretty much out of my savings, freaked out. And all I had was this deep passion for meditation, started organizing group meditations. And never in a million years did I think that organizing group meditations in my buddy’s apartment for 15 people in this period of transition when the soil wasn’t showing any flowers would lead to the big quiet and become the most big, beautiful, bright, delicious smelling flower. And it was interesting because it took over a year before that flower started to sprout. But once it sprouted after a year of what felt like nothing, that flower took off.
Judd Shaw 31:58
Strong, strong plant. That’s a great call. I love the perspective of rather than taking a box, flipping it, sitting down and just watching and waiting for something to grow, that that start already is taking place. It’s what are you doing to plowing the fields, to getting ready for the next. Be quiet. Make the soil great, that’s it. I can’t thank you enough, Jesse, for coming on. I really appreciate it. As I think as my divorce comes closer, I’m gonna write that letter. And I think that’s a great takeaway. And also take the time to celebrate new beginnings.
Jesse Israel 32:47
And one thing I’ll add to that that I think could be valuable is bringing in some of the key people from the experience that you can reflect with, mourn with, celebrate with, share the letter with, just having other people bear witness to that experience is the other key piece that I think will really allow for a beautiful close and a meaningful opening. So thinking about who those people are and considering asking them if they’d be open to having a ceremony with you, where you’re able to reflect and celebrate in this way. It’s incredible.
Jesse Israel 00:00
quiet doesn’t define who I am the big quiet will always be a part of me and the man that I am and regardless of what I’m doing or not doing what doesn’t change is me and so much of who I am comes from the experiences in my life and all of those life experiences regardless of how long they last for how long the success is for they shape me and that nobody takes away from me and that goes towards whatever I do next.
Judd Shaw 00:36
Jesse, I’m so grateful you’re here.
Jesse Israel 00:40
Thanks for having me brother, I’ve been looking forward to this.
Judd Shaw 00:43
really, really grateful. Thank you for your time. Um, you know, you started a major movement in meditation, the big quiet, it’s come to, um, to its close and we’ll talk about that. And, but the heart of it was that was meditation. And I wanted to know if, if you could lead us in a very sort of short meditation that would help us sort of set into the conversation for clarity and, and purpose and direction. What do you think?
Jesse Israel 01:20
I love that idea.
Judd Shaw 01:20
Let’s do it. Let’s do it. Okay.
Jesse Israel 01:23
All right. Great. So if you’re comfortable doing so, go ahead and close your eyes. And as we settle into the practice, just take a moment to notice the sounds of the studio that we’re in. You might hear the buzzing of the lights, sounds from off of set, maybe a little bit of a background noise from the street. Whatever those sounds are, just welcome them in, noticing them. They’ve been here this whole time, but we likely haven’t stopped to actually bring attention to them. And as we settle into those sounds, into that subtle quiet, bring your attention to your chest. Just notice how your body breathes by itself, how your chest gently rises and falls. Noticing your heart space. Notice any emotions or sensations that you might be feeling in your heart. And whatever you might be feeling, just allow yourself to feel it, just to be with it without resisting or judging. When we let ourselves feel whatever we’re feeling, it’s like opening up a window and letting in a fresh breeze of air. And now that we’re in tune with the sounds around us, in tune with our body and our emotions, you can take a moment to slowly blink open your eyes. And we’re reset. And we’re ready to go. Yes.
Judd Shaw 03:39
Wow. You know, I know meditation in my daily practice has wonders in my life, in clarity, in my nervous system. It’s just everything every day I couldn’t go without it. And that wasn’t a time in my life, you know, where I was always doing meditation was always recent. And as I’ve gotten more and more into it, I want to be able to show my loved ones, you know, my kids and, um, but I find that the, the answer that I get often is I can’t meditate or that one doesn’t work for me for people who want to get into it. And there are so many standing and walking with, what’s, what would you recommend is how to explore meditation and also how can I teach it?
Jesse Israel 04:42
Yeah. Yeah, when it comes to exploring meditation, I’d like to start by really encouraging people to understand that there’s a general misconception around meditation. And it’s that to meditate means that we are not thinking. To meditate means that the mind is silent, that the body’s relaxed. And that if we’re doing that, we’re meditating, we’re being a good meditator. And if we’re not, we’re a bad meditator, or we can’t meditate. And this is a misconception. There’s a very, very small percentage of people that can just close their eyes and silent their mind like that. You know, living in 2024, the amount of information that we process today is so great. You know, we have a different thought roughly every six seconds. So we have to be realistic when we come into practice and understand that to try to make ourselves not think is likely gonna make us actually think more. A lot of science shows that there’s as much benefit when we’re practicing and thinking as when we’re practicing and in that calmer, you know, more zen doubt state. So I really invite people to shift the mindset and understand that if the mind’s wandering in practice, it doesn’t mean that they’re doing it wrong. It actually means that it’s working, they’re getting the benefit, the stress is being released. It’s just about understanding that that’s part of the process. The other thing that I encourage people to do are to try different techniques. I really love a technique of meditation called the one giant mind technique. And there’s a free app that teaches people how to do it. There’s also the technique that I teach. And it’s not about quieting the mind. You know, it’s not about trying to make the mind be still. It’s about allowing for whatever comes up until ourselves move through it. And we think a sound, a mantra that comes from the Sanskrit language. And when we think it allows the mind and body to settle into a more relaxed state, regardless of if we’re thinking or not. So just reminding people that there are different ways to practice meditation as well. And when it comes to wanting to teach it, of course there are the obvious ways like doing meditation teacher trainings. But if it’s really just about getting people to buy in and be excited and want to practice because it’s this thing that’s so important to you, what I always recommend that people do is not push it on people. Meditation is one of these things where the more we push it on people, the more people push away from it. So I find that the best way to get people in our lives to become interested in meditation is to do it regularly ourselves and let people see the change that occurs in us, right? Become embodied in the benefit of the practice and people will start to notice the change. People will naturally become interested when they’re ready. And if we can almost attract people into the practice instead of trying to promote it on people, there’s a much more natural sort of energetic exchange that happens.
Judd Shaw 07:41
You know, as I think about my meditation practice, I watched it increase in terms of regularity through the day, which also means that maybe I’m going through more and more things, right? And those things for me are major life changes. Um, I’m approaching in, uh, in 2025, it’ll be my divorce trial after a five year divorce battle with kids involved. Um, I have my partner who will be, um, delivering our baby and I’ll have a new baby and be coming a new father. I mean, these are real life changes all within a month or two are happening. And so I’m meditating more and meditating more because I’m, I’m trying to find a way to be able to close versions of my, in my life and give them the proper honoring and also being mindful and have inner peace about the new chapters that I’m starting. You know, for me, it made me think about how four years ago when I went on a transformation and, and I, I called it my, my dark night in my soul where, where a version of me really died, totally died, but I didn’t have a cemetery. I didn’t bury it. I didn’t, I didn’t have a ceremony and it didn’t have anyone over to make a shiva call for my former version, but there it was. And I just kind of moved on through life and I’m wondering did he miss that opportunity? And so for you, uh, wow, a nine year journey on the big quiet, which was so incredible leading, you know, some of the largest meditations in some of the coolest places on the planet, but come the summer, you decided that that journey had reached its, its end. And how do you know when to close something? When’s it the right time? And let’s, let’s focus on this first part about the closing chapters. How do I honor my divorce?
Jesse Israel 10:00
Yeah. Well, thanks, man, for being open about what’s real for you in your life right now. And I just got to say, I love that you’re thinking about this stuff through the lens of cycles, because everything in life, like everything in nature, is built around a cycle. Something is born, creation occurs, that thing grows for a period of time, and eventually at some point, the timeframe is always different, it returns back to the start and it’s ready to be complete. So good. And when nature’s cycle is complete, the next cycle is ready to be born. So I love that you’re naturally seeing that there’s something to that, because I think when we get outside of nature and we get into busy life in society, there’s a lot of shame around things closing. There’s a lot of shame around cycles completing. Especially when the timeline doesn’t line up with what we thought it was going to look like, for something like a marriage. When we go into the marriage, there’s a good chance that the two people getting married think they’re going to be together for a lifetime. And if something changes and that timeline is shorter than planned, that can be really painful. And with that, there can be a lot of shame or there can be the sensation of failure. And why I really like your question is because I think it’s so important for us to think if it’s a relationship, if it’s family dynamics, if it’s friendships, if it’s businesses, whatever it might be, there’s a timeline, there’s a cycle. And when it’s ready to be complete, the more we’re able to accept and embrace, and like you said, ritualize and celebrate the closing of the chapter, the more we are able to align with what nature naturally wants for us, which is for change to occur and for creation of something new to be born. So you asked, how do we become in touch with that? How do we get into that flow and that rhythm of the cycle of all things? And I’ve had two major career cycles like this in my life. I ran a record label for nine years from the age of 20 to 29. And then I ran the big quiet for nine years from the age of 30 to 39. And the first time I had that big transition of leaving this record label, this thing I started in my dorm room when I was a sophomore at NYU, and as it was really kind of picking up its growth, I felt like it was so clear that it was time to move on, which was so confusing. I had my practice of meditation as a tool that allowed me to not only hear that it was time, but to have the courage to act on it. So the first piece to this is, what are the tools and practices that we have in our lives that allow us to really hear and trust that deeper intuition? Because so much of understanding when it makes sense to make a change has to do with a deeper feeling. I believe that nature’s intelligence speaks through us through a fine level of feeling. It’s an intuitive feeling. It’s something we get in the gut. And for some people, it might take years before it’s clear that it’s time to act on that thing. For me, I started to get the feelings two years or so before we closed the Big Quiet that it was probably coming.
Jesse Israel 13:28
And it took me a year of putting the Big Quiet on a break and saying, let me just get a little breathing room here before we make any decisions. Because it was so scary to look at it. And then eventually reached a point going into this year where it became really clear that it was time. So I think part of this is, how do we have the tools and the practices that allow us to get clear? Can we give ourselves the time and the patience without rushing into it, without feeling any shame or pressure to let the feeling naturally emerge that we know it’s time? And then once we know that it is time, once we are ready to act on that change, what can we do to celebrate, ceremonialize, and ritualize that closing? So I think it actually would be really interesting and fun to think about and talk through ways you might do that as your divorce comes to a completion. Because there’s so much probably to grieve and to celebrate there. And if it’s helpful, I can share what I did for the Big Quiet as my way of closing that chapter and celebrating it so I could really open it to the next thing.
Judd Shaw 14:33
I’d love to hear it.
Jesse Israel 14:34
Yeah, so for us, there was so much excitement and popularity around the growth of the Big Quiet. Like you mentioned, we were doing mass meditations at a scale that really no one else was doing. By our five-year anniversary, we were touring with Oprah and filling arenas of people in silence. And it was the coolest thing. And I think because it was so unique and because it was of service to so many people, there was a lot of hype around it. So of course, so much of my identity was tied to doing this one thing. So when it became clear that it was time to say goodbye to it, I was really kind of stuck with, do I just let this quietly fizzle and just never really say anything and hope that people don’t really ask? Or do we really put it out there? Do we really say to our community of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people to say, we did this amazing thing together. We were able to create this because of you and what we were able to magically bring into existence through all of these times over nine years. And like we talked about, like you and I just talked about, in nature, there’s a cycle to all things. And it’s become very clear to us that the cycle of the Big Quiet is complete. So we wanna honor that. And in doing so, we made a short film, three-minute short film that celebrates the nine-year journey of the Big Quiet. And we shared that film. We screened that film. We blasted it out. We put it on our Instagrams and our social media feeds. And it was a way to tell the story and thank everyone that was involved. We also did a billboard at Times Square. New York City was where the Big Quiet was started. It was very much our home. So the billboard was a way to say, thanks NYC for getting quiet with us for all these years. We’re signing up, we’re saying goodbye. And the last thing I’ll mention that was so powerful for me was I wrote a letter to the Big Quiet. This was just the me and the Big Quiet thing. I wrote a letter to the Big Quiet, referring to the Big Quiet as you, saying, you taught me this. I learned this from you, you did this for me. And in that letter, was able to really celebrate our nine years, thank the Big Quiet for what it taught me, say goodbye and say, you’ll always be a part of me.
Judd Shaw 16:52
Hmm, I love that because for me, it sounds like you’re not only honoring this identity, this creature that you made into something, but also honoring all of those that were on the journey with you. You don’t steal it or rob it from them. Right. Who’s like, what happened to the big quiet? And so they get to celebrate along with you.
Jesse Israel 17:21
You nailed it. And I hadn’t considered how powerful that, what you just said would be. Because people would say to me, why not just keep it on the side? Who knows, maybe in a couple of years, you wanna bring it back, just let it be. And I considered that. But if I had taken that approach, what would have never happened would have been the closure that came that allowed hundreds and hundreds of people to reach out to us and to send messages and to write letters, sharing what the Big Quiet meant for them, getting photographs of babies, of couples that met through the Big Quiet events, to just hear about the impact. That was one of the most potent experiences of my life, to really be reminded of the impact of what this thing did in the world. And that wouldn’t have happened if we hadn’t publicly celebrated the closure.
Judd Shaw 18:12
Yeah. And allows all of those people to continue the journey with you into whatever your next is too, because now they know that part has come to a close. Yeah, you know, that’s so helpful. I think when I’m thinking about the divorce, there is a lot of things that, almost miracles that have come out of my divorce proceeding that in the beginning, I was fighting. In the beginning, I was struggling against, but all of these things that happened, had to happen exactly the way they had to happen. And so I think for me, one of the things I’d like to do is have a ceremony, you know, for that version of myself that I put away, that I laid down and said, this is no longer going to be me. But instead of just starting and being like, okay, I’m back in the game. And like I change clothes, having this real moment, because I think that that’s how the stepping stone to opening a new chapter.
Jesse Israel 19:25
Oh, it’s so spot on Judd, because we’re talking a lot about nature and nature cycles. When you do what you just said there, when you really ceremonialize and celebrate an ending, it honors nature cycle. And I believe that it just creates even more energy that flows in to that next chapter or to that next cycle. I think by celebrating the closing of something, we just enhance and boost up the energy for the thing that we’re now making space for. So I think that that process gets really supported.
Judd Shaw 19:58
Yeah. And that sounds like that process is applied to our personal and professional lives, changes of jobs. I mean, what we’re talking about are major life transitions. When one door closes, another opens. When the plant withers and dies, it fertilizes soil for something else to grow. When these new things grow, how do we celebrate properly the new start?
Jesse Israel 20:29
Well, I’ll tell you that probably the single most meaningful experience or practice that I had over this process of saying goodbye to the big quiet that allowed me to really open up into the joy and excitement of what’s next came from crying. You know, I had to learn how to allow myself to grieve what the big quiet was, what I thought it was going to be, the way that I was perceived, I could feel that changing. You know, when the big quiet was, you know, at its peak before we went on our break a couple of years ago, there was so much inbound, there was so much interest for the big quiet for me. And when we took our break, I really watched that slow down and it changed the way that I felt I was in the world. And it shifted these parts of my identity. And to a certain extent, I had to grieve that version of myself. And that was probably one of the hardest and most powerful things I’ve ever done to say, I’m consciously making a choice for this moment to take a break from some of the recognition, because it’s aligned with what I know I’m ready to do next. But in doing so, saying goodbye to some of that and then saying goodbye to some of that, missing what it felt like to be recognized and to be celebrated and to always be wanted. And it’s really what I needed because I needed the space to really get clear on the next thing. But to do that, I had some good cries about it, man, you know, some big, deep ones. And it was through some of that emotional purging and letting myself really feel the emotional change that on the other side of it, I was able to feel so solid, you know, so locked in, so clear that the big quiet doesn’t define who I am. The big quiet will always be a part of me and the man that I am. And regardless of what I’m doing or not doing, what doesn’t change is me. And so much of who I am comes from the experiences in my life and all of those life experiences, regardless of how long they last for, how long the success is for, they shape me. And that nobody takes away from me. And that goes towards whatever I do next. So I was able to take all of the energy and learning of that chapter of my life and be like, all right, now it’s time to go bring it to the next thing and to celebrate the next thing and feel excited about the next thing. So yeah, being with emotions, feeling emotions, you know, releasing the emotions that emerge and change, I think have so much to do with how we open up into what’s next. And then not being afraid to be public about this stuff, you know, to speak about this stuff. It’s so easy to feel shame around closing or for chapters ending and to not want to talk about it. And what I found was that by acknowledging it, it put it out to the universe that there’s change happening and that there’s new things opening and it’s created more energy, more excitement for what’s next.
Judd Shaw 23:32
You know, it sounds like there are people, and I imagine this to be an incredibly lonely place that had built an identity attached to something, and they just cannot close it, even though it doesn’t have the same aura, the vibe, the energy, and they’re holding onto it out of either this incredible fear of letting it die or what’s the next. Yes. What do you say to those, these people who are really deeply stuck in this unwillingness to release this identity when they just know it’s no longer the thing?
Jesse Israel 24:15
And it’s so common, what you’ve just described. And I think for a lot of people, they’ll go most their lives in that grip. And we do see this a lot in relationships and in careers. And not everybody has the means to be able to always take the leap. Right. So I think that’s always important to make room for that. But ultimately, I think there are two key pieces to it. One is understanding that everybody’s timeline for getting clear about when it’s time to take the leap is different. And that I think for so many of us, we need to go through extended periods of it being out of alignment for us to realize that it’s time to actually make the change. Sometimes we just have to really feel how unaligned something is to get to that place. And what I see is that when a cycle in nature is ready to be completed, and we’re not allowing for the completion to occur, and we’re holding on like you’ve described, nature will start to force the change. And this is when gnarly, uncomfortable stuff starts to occur. And sometimes we need those forces to get us to act on it.
Judd Shaw 25:28
You’re working against the universe, you just keep the exact way.
Jesse Israel 25:31
Act, whack. Exactly. And the harder people hold on, the harder the whacks. I noticed that in my first career transition, there were a lot more whacks. In the second career transition, 10 years later, I was able to more naturally trust in nature’s process, and I think align more with the flow of it. So less pain, less whacking. So yeah, so I think part of it is that, is just understanding that. And I think the other pieces is when people are really holding on tight, I like to ask them about what their relationship is to trust and faith and believing in a greater power or a greater energy that supports them. And there’s a lot of good that happens. There’s a lot that gets unpacked in that conversation because if somebody has lost connection with or relationship to their ability to trust in something greater, to trust in the natural unfolding of their life, that trust is lost, the grip and the holding on gets really tight. Absolutely. But if we can talk about ways that they can reestablish that deeper sense of trust and build more of that faith or knowingness within themselves, then the grip starts to loosen. And I find that different people have different practices or people or whatever it might be that allows them to come back into a place of trust.
Judd Shaw 26:50
Hmm. How, how do you, um, how would one anchor into, um, into the belief that, like, where they’re heading is the right thing. You know, they say purpose and passion and gut and what, like, for you, where do you dial that sense in? You know, some, some parts I would imagine, for me, it’s the meditations, the getting, just allowing space to have the clarity of what is next.
Jesse Israel 27:26
Yeah, you know, one thing that I find pretty consistently, and this is more so through my work mentoring people and coaching leaders, is that for most of us, the data’s there if we look back on our lives. So a lot of times I’ll say, think about a moment in your life where you felt similarly, right? Where the grip was really tight, you kind of lost your ability to trust that things were going to work out. What was that moment in your life previously where that happened? And what happened once you start, once you let go? What happened once you allowed yourself to open up to trust again? And pretty consistently, people are able to say, every time I’ve been in a situation like this and I’ve surrendered, it’s worked out. Consistently, people will say it. And even at the times where they let go and it led to something painful, it worked out. So, so much of this, people inherently know if we can get them to look back on their history and see how it’s been, how history has repeated itself for them when it comes to this time and time again. And sometimes all we need to do is be reminded of how it’s been proven to us that it exists in our lives to allow us to start to open up. Now, if you want to supercharge that, throw in a practice like meditation. You know, for me, like I mentioned, that gave me the clarity and the courage to act on it.
Judd Shaw 28:54
When somebody is closing their chapter, something, whether it be a major life transition or a work transition, there’s also times where that little sprout doesn’t come up right away. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I have felt like, uh-oh, where’s the growth? Where’s this next thing? The sun has risen and I don’t see anything coming from the ground. How do you find the patience in allowing that? In other words, I think that a lot of people would feel that just as that nature cycle happens, that just because something closes, something immediately opens. And sometimes you can close something without having your next game.
Jesse Israel 29:41
It’s very common to run with this thinking around the sprout, the seed sprouting and turning into a flower, yeah, the human desires is we want that thing to grow fast instantly. And again, not always the case, timeline’s always different just like it is in nature. And I think the best way to run with that metaphor is to understand that it’s not just about the growth of the seedling. It’s not just about the flower, it’s also about the soil. So when we’re in transitions, it’s so important that our focal point isn’t placed on the flower, it’s placed on the soil. What can we do to cultivate the healthiest possible soil and really farm that soil and prepare that soil for harvest? So what that’s looked like for me and a lot of people that I’ve worked with, it means just really doubling down on how we take care of ourselves, how we nurture ourselves, how we cultivate joy in the face of the unknown. And understand that by doing what we can to really focus on us and make that soil nutrient dense and rich, that with time, the seedlings will start to sprout. But that also goes back to trust, that also goes back to understanding that things aren’t always in our control, the timelines aren’t always in our control. When I left my record label, I was convinced that within three months, I’d have a concept for a tech startup that I’d raise a lot of money for and that I’d go bring to the world. And a year later, I was pretty much out of my savings, freaked out. And all I had was this deep passion for meditation, started organizing group meditations. And never in a million years did I think that organizing group meditations in my buddy’s apartment for 15 people in this period of transition when the soil wasn’t showing any flowers would lead to the big quiet and become the most big, beautiful, bright, delicious smelling flower. And it was interesting because it took over a year before that flower started to sprout. But once it sprouted after a year of what felt like nothing, that flower took off.
Judd Shaw 31:58
Strong, strong plant. That’s a great call. I love the perspective of rather than taking a box, flipping it, sitting down and just watching and waiting for something to grow, that that start already is taking place. It’s what are you doing to plowing the fields, to getting ready for the next. Be quiet. Make the soil great, that’s it. I can’t thank you enough, Jesse, for coming on. I really appreciate it. As I think as my divorce comes closer, I’m gonna write that letter. And I think that’s a great takeaway. And also take the time to celebrate new beginnings.
Jesse Israel 32:47
And one thing I’ll add to that that I think could be valuable is bringing in some of the key people from the experience that you can reflect with, mourn with, celebrate with, share the letter with, just having other people bear witness to that experience is the other key piece that I think will really allow for a beautiful close and a meaningful opening. So thinking about who those people are and considering asking them if they’d be open to having a ceremony with you, where you’re able to reflect and celebrate in this way. It’s incredible.
